Exit polls in the Spanish election were not only wrong, they were wrong by mind-numbing amounts. United We Can was supposed to pick up seats. Instead it dropped by million votes.
Is this just another case of bad polls, or is something else happening?
Fraud allegations charges revolve around the company Indra awarded a contract to count the vote.
The company claims to speed up the counting process via technologies such as OCR, OMR and ICR , which provide reliability, speed and transparency.
Recount Petitioned Filed
A Recount Petition is underway.
Here are the charges as translated from the above link.
1) The Interior Ministry in charge of counting the votes, has previously been caught flagrantly using the institution and the police to destroy political rivals.
2) The government skipped its typical bidding process and gave the contract for counting votes of the June 26 election by “negotiated procedure” – something totally unusual in this type of contract. Indra is a different company than the one that counted the December 20 election, which won through competitive bidding.
3) Indra is fully wrapped in a web of corruption with the Popular Party.
4) The election results do not correspond at all with any of all surveys: never in the history of democracy had given such differences.
Reader Bran emailed, “there is a push to have the voting boxes opened and counted manually, under observation of the electoral commission.”
This of course assumes the ballots have not already been destroyed.
Mike “Mish” Shedlock
200 000 signatures and counting for a full audit. The main point is, above all else, that an error of 20%, including by two exit polls sampling 132 000 people, is simply not believable.
All ballot papers except those questioned are destroyed immediately after the count. The count takes place at the electoral table and the provisonal result is provided by, in this case, Indra. The final result is supposed to be after the electoral commission obtains all 50 000 signed table results, and adds them up before witnesses. Apparently even this procedure is skipped in favour of simply using the provisional results. Though I find that last point hard to believe, it may be true, leaving room for major fraud. No individual party dares raise the stakes for now, as a mere official political accusation would.
Ballot destruction is normal process
As the great Italian journalist, Luigi Barzini (wiki) said, “Thank God for the Spanish. Otherwise the Italians would be the worst people in Europe…” One must always remember that Franco died of natural causes & that 30% of tthe population regret the passing of El Caudillo. Spain is its own kind of mess, contributing in its own way to Trainwreck Europa. Let’s hope Brexit is not derailed by our Monetary Politburo cum Warfare state.
Diogenes of Sinope said:
Michael (@2:25) : “Now, who approached you, Tartaglia or Barzini?”
Carlo (about to be executed) : “…it was Barzini.”
The US was settled by the British and thrived while the rest of the Americas which were settled by the Spanish have swirled around the toilet bowl for 500 years. Wonder why. Of course the people who were governed by such things as the Magna Carta have been diluted over the last 50 years and probably why we are going in the same direction.
They left us with Indians who believe they are Hispaniards.
Graf Zeppelin said:
Living memories of the cataclysmic experience that Spain endured during its civil war served as Francisco Franco’s most effective bodyguard while he lived, and, to the extent that such memories still survive, they very likely still resonate in the collective Spanish consciousness today. Violent social revolution advocated by the hard left in the 1930s retained so little appeal with the public that, by the end of the 1950s, the PCE (Spanish communist party), was forced to adopt policies that eventually became difficult to distinguish from those of the social democrats. Finally, Spanish colonialism very largely ended almost two centuries ago, a fact which alone should call into serious question claims that Spain is the cause such political and social dysfunctionalities as persist in its former colonies.
Ricky Mango said:
Franco was a dictator, no doubt about it, but just compare it with, say, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot… If you know anything about the Spanish civil war –which Franco won– you will find out that the alternative to Franco –a Comintern-masterminded government in the South of Europe with a Cold War on the horizon– would have been an absolute nightmare. So it wouldn’t be wrong to say that Franco was the lesser of two evils.
Spain managed to remain more or less neutral through the whole period , something which reflects in its character – no Vichy government , no reparations or outside imposition , just a dreadful civil war and a hard but relatively simple dictatorship to guide it through to modern times . I don’t doubt some miss when they felt they fully owned the country , no matter the delay in progress that accompanied being isolated .
Graf Zeppelin said:
As long as the war situation favored the Axis, Franco succeeded in “playing” both Mussolini and Hitler by repeatedly postponing (better: stalling) a decision to enter the war on the side of the Axis powers. Finding itself economically prostrate after the devastation that resulted from the civil war, however, the nation literally had no other realistic choice. So irritated was Hitler (who never did hit it off with Franco, by the way), that the Führer is on record as griping that the considerable aid that Germany and Italy had extended to the Spanish Nationalists amounted to nothing more than a gift). Once the tide turned, Spain was still an officially neutral nation, and the country managed to enter the Cold War era as a 100% no-doubt-about-it bastion of anti-communism—and constituted, accordingly, an enormous strategic advantage to the former Allied Powers. Yes, Franco was a dictator, and, while by no means may he be considered a saint, El Caudillo did always consider the custodianship of his country nothing less than his personal responsibility. Although Franco, largely on account of his still being made to lug all the proto-fascist baggage from the 1930s, garners virtually no credit today, it does not amount to a stretch to conclude that through his office, Spain was able to avoid the fate of becoming a rigidly Stalinist, Soviet-style regime, and at the very worst possible historical juncture. That fact means, among a great deal of other things, that at least several million Spaniards are alive today, who, but for that greatly lamented Nationalist victory in 1939, would not otherwise exist.
About the voting, I believe there was fraud, but the media is not covering it. In fact all they said is “true that you cannot trust the minister, but to talk about fraud is exagarations”… In the next news, appears 500 votes lost in the election, but nothing changes… haha stuff like that.
Votes burnt three days after the election day.
In relation with the comments about Franco… “spain was neutral” my ass.
As much as United State of America talk about freedom and democracy… United State fucked our democratic ass, supporting the dictator when there was a republic legitimated by the people before. Just because it was better to fight again Russia CCCP. But Spain in the republic wasnt mainly communist. The thing is when the military sended to protect the colonies in the north of Africa stand up against the legitimated govern, he get help from Hitler. And after the war he get help from the United States.. So is not that he was “neutral”… But that he was useful for the united states. Because he was killing people like the rest of the dictators. In fact, Spain is in the top 5 of countries with more “dissapeared people” since then.
I want to talk also about something very curious that not a lot of people know. The virgins of Ezkioga. It´s an history very similar to the Salem witches. And it was the right wing of people paying poor to say the see things.. Look that people was the “neutral” hahahah.
Uh, oh,,,the lemmings are getting wise.
LOL… just had to add some lemming cartoons :
Ethical tallies have a representative from each party at the ballot box. The representatives mutually agree on the count before it is submitted to a central counting. Each representative knows the agreed count and can verify whether the public number tallied is the agreed count.
The Spanish count lacks representatives from each party. Only one party knows the count from each and every polling place. The count is like an open box of chocolate candy in a room empty except for one hungry Spaniard.
Representatives from each party are allowed, but it does not happen like that in practice . Though each table posts its tally publicly in the form of a physical paper notice there , copies of that are kept in a somewhat random manner and are hard to cross check with official provisional (and verified) results, which do not openly offer table detail .
The table results are presented to the local court without any form of oversight in their transfer (i.e. a table rep. walks off with them) , and so it is possible that they are changed along the way .
The provisional official results are facilitated by a private company , in this case Indra , a company involved in various scandals and fully enmeshed with PP . They are supposedly garnered from table results in the act , programming fraud is easy along the way .
The results fed through the courts should land at the desk of the electoral commission , run by an interior minister who is currently being discredited . It is unknown if they will even be counted properly there . So there are calls for the entire list to be made public .
The two left wing groups , who I do not sympathize with ironically , ran apart and gained over six million votes six months ago , they combined and were polled by all (over ten different) companies before , and two at exit , as having at least their combined previous vote . The actual official results took away over a million votes however , with PP picking up 700 000 votes . No one can explain this, the pollster naturally look for migration between parties beforehand and include any such tendencies in their results . Obviously it is possible there is a polling error , however unlikely , but there are other pointers too . For example it is said that the only results that came in as per polls were in Cataluña and Euskadi , independentist regions where central government does not have loyal infrastructure in place , though even this is inconclusive I suppose .
All ballots (except individual ones contested during the initial count – i.e. as questionably marked ) are now destroyed .
So it remains to be seen if a detailed scrutiny is somehow allowed of the tallied results so as to cross check them in available ways for possible fraud ….
Ricky Mango said:
I sounds really alarming. And there are historical precedents of vote tampering in Spain.
Well the main stream media is saying nothing at all for now , zero . The fact that no one in position has questioned the result at all in any way makes me more uneasy than having the social networks very busy discussing the possibility . That is what is alarming to me , the gap between different sectors and the lack of any open discussion, or of any attempt to clarify, or to even acknowledge that there are questions being asked . So apart from the petition for audit , the next best way to be heard is to take to the street maybe , a protest is planned for the 2nd , maybe no one will turn up , maybe it will end in riots , no way to tell .
To be fair , no one suspecting a large fraud has anything solidly presentable to accuse with , but the suspicions won’t rest until there has been some kind of investigation .
David Sisler (@davesizzle) said:
To update the quote from “A Man For All Seasons”….good heavens, man, this isn’t Chicago.
The Federal Reserve’s polling data seems strikingly incorrect at the moment. It’s not “QE Four” that’s coming but appears to be QE Failure.
As has already happened in Japan and Europe.
In the case of Japan for three decades now.
Uncle Sugar looks like he’s out of the smack.
“Conservative values.” Gotta love ’em.
Should we be getting ready for a 2nd amendment style of voting? There is more and more at stake as the EU BS continues.
Long time reader, will never make an account said:
Haven’t checked any aspect of this article, but thought it interesting enough to pass on considering it discusses a different Spanish vote counting company that may/may not count votes for American elections.
Probably some facts are true in the story, but again I didn’t cross check.
Nor left nor right wing associated counts are trusted, some go as far as to insinuate that at certain levels they encourage each other or even conspire. Indra has achieved a certain notoriety in the field, SCYTL no doubt is worth observing also. That said, in the US as in Spain currently, as long as there is a manual count, the data providers can only be part of a wider system of fraud, they cannot actually unverifiably program a result, only camouflage other fraud, or help it along. I personally see no way that a purely electronic voting system can guarantee that large fraud does not take place – there would be work arounds to any kind of attempt at audit.
When this reaches the level of voter fraud in Philly – wake me up.
More than 100% of all registered voters voting…
Not one vote for the opposition in nearly 100 polling locations….
the dead voting for years…
115 year olds voting…
Observers kicked out of polling stations…
Black Panthers out side polling stations in uniform and with weapons..
You can also see why democrats fight any sort of voter ID….
Sharon Jarvis said:
That is because there isn’t much individual voter fraud in the U.S. Numerous studies done by the likes of the Brennan Center and others found a minute number of cases. Individual voter fraud was usually done with mail-in ballots, for which I.D.s are not required. There is, however, plenty of election fraud which the mainstream media generally ignores.
you mean 120% of all eligible voters are voting……lol
No offense to the Spanish, but as an American, I am far more concerned with the rampant voting fraud right here in the USA
Ron J said:
“No offense to the Spanish, but as an American, I am far more concerned with the rampant voting fraud right here in the USA”
Just what i was thinking about.
I didn’t see the story, but i saw a teaser for a local TV news story about dead people supposedly voting in California. Also, a number of independent Sanders supporters who wanted to vote for him in the California primary, were allegedly blocked from doing so, by balloting rules that the democratic party operatives apparently didn’t want Sanders supporters to be aware of. This from a party that claims it wants everyone to be able to vote and that every vote should count.
I am not a fan of socialism, but the voter fraud Hillary used to “beat” Sanders is stunning. Add in the tax evasion, money laundering and bribe solicitation that is the Clinton Foundation…
Its not that Trump is without fault, but the DNC really needs to ask themselves why they are pushing a crime family onto the ballot.
There are millions of women who are not criminals. There are millions of democrats who are not criminals. Why aren’t any of them allowed to run against Hillary?
Why does the demoncratic party want to be associated with organized crime?
Graf Zeppelin said:
Because the People’s Democrat Party (PDP) is the party of the state, and the state is itself “Exhibit A” an example of organized crime.
An article in Catalan description by a monitor of how votes are ignored in the counting process, (tried google translate, result not very clear)
if someone fluent can read it, please clarify.
In Spanish instead of Catalan
He is complaining about how he witnesses how the vote is handled and points out where fraud could occur … no proper supervision , estimating result by ignoring missing ballots , mailed in votes easy to manipulate , results easily altered by reps. during or after the count , chaos in the court where they are handed , results before counting finished .
Apart from the possibility of a smaller kind of local fraud , which in my opinion would have to be impossibly well organized to account for the large differences being questioned and not be detected. He gives the impression that the count is chaotic .
As table count results are public , theoretically there should be no major fraud afterwards that cannot be detected , and he is concentrated on the table count . However a major fraud would be more likely in the relay of the information , as the information transmitted is rarely checked with local table records , and therefore not likely to be detected without a full audit .
So in essence he is claiming how slack the system is.